Host: Heather Volchko
Guest: Alexander Grosso and Marla Watts-Pacheco
So all month we've been talking about closure, and with closure typically comes a heavy amount of chaos. So last week we were talking about all the chaotic things and just how do we keep ourselves grounded, and how do we keep ourselves present and able to keep showing up to work every day? And so the last week of the month, here we are talking about those new beginnings, because when one thing ends, something else is beginning. Sometimes we don't know what that is, but with an end of something is the beginning of something else. So this week we're going to talk about how do we embrace those new beginnings? How do we choose to have optimism?
How do we kind of look to the future, what we don't know, with just encouragement and excitement amidst the chaos and confusion that we might be experiencing in the current moment? So I'm wondering, for me, some of the things that are coming up with new beginnings is there is excitement around the beginning of a school year. There is just the newness, the freshness, the opportunity. Like, we'll see what's coming.
It's kind of a natural new beginning that happens in the school calendar. But a lot of times, when there's closure, we've been talking about this month, when a staff moves on somewhere else or a student no longer comes back for services, you know, there's an aspect of closure that happens there. They have their own beginning that we aren't necessarily a part of. And we don't get to start that off with someone, either at the beginning of the school year or as we're getting to know someone new that we're working with.
So for you, what are some of the things that keep you optimistic, that keep you engaged and encouraged as you're looking forward to whatever is next for your people or even maybe for yourself?
Marla: I think for me, it's the clients and the families I work with that keep me optimistic. Those that I know that are putting in the hard work, because as we said before, it takes a village, right? It can't just be us going to the homes or to the schools or into the clinics and doing it all, but just the work that I know that my families are putting in or my students are putting in.
Sometimes even getting that personal feedback from my own clients. I really like how we're doing this, Miss Watts or whatever, and just kind of like hearing their positives of us going into their homes, that kind of keeps me optimistic. Like, okay, things are going to go really well when they're meeting their goals, when we're curbing some of those negative behaviors, teaching those positive, pro-social behaviors.
And for myself, too, practicing that self-care, right? And being optimistic because again, you cannot have. You cannot be pessimistic and optimistic at the same time, right? So just kind of practicing that self-care as well and knowing that, again, being gentle with yourself and having that self-compassion and understanding more of yourself and just knowing, again, that you're doing your best and walking in with your head up high and just kind of taking it on. So just being the optimistic. And then also, if you shine that, others might model that too, right? And so, yeah, because that can be contagious, I hope.
Oh, yeah. I mean, just as all the negativity and the chaos can be contagious, when someone is genuinely showing up in that chaos with some optimism, with some like, hey, but here's an angle, here's an opportunity, here's something, right? And it's not just empty, right? Like, oh, there's, you know, I'm being optimistic because why? Right? But it's actually grounded; it's rooted in something to be optimistic around. That can be contagious. And I've seen whole moments and whole cultures of even school buildings shift when focusing on all of that negativity and all of the chaos, and, like, all of that's real.
But when that just takes over, all of the communications and all of everything that's going on, then that's really as good as you can get. You have someone who comes in and is like, Hey, actually, what about? And you start shifting and kind of turning the culture of those conversations. I mean, that's part of what Matthew and I were talking about last month, too. I was just like the culture around us, and how can we kind of create and impact that? I mean, that's exactly what you're talking about, is you can come in with that optimism or that, you know, just being able to see something that maybe the people in the chaos aren't seeing, and rally that, and that can completely turn the whole scenario. Even, I've seen outcomes change completely for both staff and students.
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You can't be pessimistic and optimistic at the same time.
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Marla: Yeah. And that's why I say, practicing that self-care, right? Because you have to be genuine, right?
And you really have to provide yourself that space to give permission to have breaks and to recharge, right? And so that way, you can have a spirit of optimism and share that to others and hope that others can also adopt that. So that's why I was kind of alluding to self-care. And again, for me, that's how I would view how I can stay optimistic for the sake of others that I work with.
Alex: Yeah, I agree with practically everything you said, Marla. Like, at the end of the day, what we're looking for is what I mean, what we're working for are the clients that we serve. And you can be jaded about parts of your job, that's fine, but at the end of the day, that part of it, that part where we serve these clients and their families and the schools or whatever you may do, that outweighs everything else. That's why we're doing what we're doing. We wouldn't be here still in this profession if that wasn't worth it at all.
You know, I will never forget to this day the reason why I'm here. I started off on a very tough case. It was a case at the clinic that I first started working with, really wanted to get with because they were at the same school, and they were observing the therapy that he was getting from his previous provider, and it was messed up. It wasn't the nicest therapy. They didn't treat him right. So when the opportunity came, when the family decided to leave, and the clinic kind of jumped in there, like, hey, we'll toss our hat in this ring.
I'll never forget when the BCBA called me and she told me, Hey, like, got this really tough case. We really tried hard to get him, and we were able to finally get him. I remember starting that case. It was intense, but I remember I was there three months into it. I was in the classroom, and another BCBA in the classroom looked at me and she was like, Look, you've been through a lot with him already. I'm like, yeah, I know. And she's like, if you're still here because of, despite all of that, you're meant for this, and that is always stuck.
Marla: I totally get you.
Alex: It's true. But, I mean, there was a point, you know? And I guess looking back on that moment now as a BCBA and seeing how much turnover there is in my field when things get tough, that there was a lot of truth to what she said because I was like, yeah, you're right. I'm still here. I stayed with that kid for five years, and now as a BCBA, I see how some RBTs, like, when the going gets tough, they get going.
So I now think about that, and I've told other RBTs that story. You know, I'm like, look, you know, if you are still here at this very moment, despite everything you've gone through, this is where you should be. And I think that carries over to the bigger core component of everything that we do, which is servicing the family, servicing the kids. And, yeah, you know, maybe you don't get closure on some of those, but at the end of the day, that shouldn't stop you from doing the overall good.
And I think that's really important when it comes to keeping your mindset and your mental state healthy and happy, because if you go in forgetting your main purpose of what you're doing, you kind of, I mean, it's very easy to get burnt out and just kind of fall down a really dark rabbit hole. And I also feel like a lot of it, too, is just balance. It's very easy for us to not have balance.
I found that out. And I'm sure Heather and Marla, you guys can agree that you could very easily tip the scales and just become a workaholic because there's always something to do in our profession, whether it be research and trying to figure out interventions for a new behavior that you've never come across or families reaching out to you at odd hours in the evening or cancellations and you're trying to figure out how to pivot, there's always something going on, and if there isn't something going on, that just means it's gonna come all at once. Later on, it's coming as they come. Like, it's gonna be like a really horrible day where everything goes wrong very quickly and you just gotta ride that chaos. But for the most part, that's what keeps me going. It's knowing that what I'm doing, and the kids and the families who have stuck around with me, they're satisfied with the services they're getting.
They're seeing the change, and they're willing to do everything they can to ensure that that continues. And that's what keeps me going. And just having the right balance. The balance is really important, and I learned that more recently than I like to admit because I used to cheer as a BCBA. First years of BCBA, I was just on my phone.
No, like. And that is real. I think with every season, with every, you know, any change that happens, then it's relearning what does balance look like. And I know there have been seasons where I have zero balance, and that is somewhat by design. And then it's the optimism of, okay, but this is for a season, right? Like, there is a reason, and it's for a season. And at the end of that season, then balance. Focus on that and recalibrate and shift into that.
But I think that's… You're kind of hinting at one of the things that I look at is where one door closes, another door opens, right? It's that saying. Where it's like, yes, it's hard and it hurts, and closure isn't easy. Especially, we've talked so much this month about it just isn't given to us in the ways that we would want to be able to walk through it. But for me, and kind of the way I look at things is going, okay, well, if that's not it, then what is? And then it positions me to be able to ask and wonder and seek and look and maybe find things that I would not necessarily have found before. And so I've always been the person to embrace those silver linings in the chaos of the crisis because it is a learning opportunity. I'm learning things about my student, about my colleagues, about our procedures or processes, right?
And then that sets us up for success next time. Maybe not even with that student, but just as us, as a team, or, like you were saying, dig into the research and learning new skills, or I'm confronted with something that I've not had to do before. And now here we are. I'm jumping in, and I'm expanding and I'm growing. And I think those are opportunities that some of it comes out of hurt and pain and loss, of things ending and people moving on, or us moving on and then exploring other opportunities, right? But I've had multiple times where doors have been closed, and that hurt.
That pain is very real. And then walking through that is kind of the, okay, so what's next? Right? Because that door is closed now. There's something else now. What is that thing? And then I get to go and pursue that and explore that. If that's on a professional level or a personal level, or quite honestly, even with some of my students, something is not an option. It's not an opportunity.
So let's pivot. If it's not that, what is it? It doesn't have to be nothing, because it's not that. It's okay, let's go. Let's go and explore and learn, and try to figure it out together.
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If you are still here at this very moment, despite everything you've gone through, this is where you should be.
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Marla: Yeah.
Alex: Couldn't agree with you more.
So, as we're kind of wrapping up this month, I'm wondering for you: when you're thinking back through all of these crazy things that you have worked through, the scenarios, I always say the stories you can't make up, all of these things that is just the reality of what we do. What do you do that keeps you in a place where you can find and keep that optimism, where you can find what's next, that you can even focus on your own personal growth as you're walking through either closure or change, or transition?
Marla: How do I keep my optimism? You know, I know I touched base a little bit on self-care, right? I think that also goes to celebrating the progress and milestones that you've done, right? Or that you've seen, no matter how big or small they are. Recognizing your efforts and your resilience, and your overall growth is something important to reflect. And I don't know if you said this already, Alex, or not, but remembering your why, right? Of, like, why I’m here.
And hopefully, with that, noticing those moments of happiness, success, and meaningful connections of how, whatever it is that's going to prompt your why. With that, I also think about building a support system or connections with others, right? How are we going to connect with other individuals that share the same experience as us? [It] kind of helps me with my optimism. Again, Kind of like, feeling like you're not the only one that's going through this.
Whatever that's going to like, bring a sense of belonging. And make sense of that. I think those are some ways that can kind of help with your optimism. But, yeah, that's a very good question that I'm going to have to keep pondering on. Definitely.
Alex: I agree with everything you said, Marla. I think those are the exact reasons that you should be doing it. But also, it's gonna sound kind of funny, but data. Data: it kind of keeps the world churning. Like, when you see some really good data, you're just like, man, this is great. It's like, no better feeling when your guys start mastering so many different little skills here and there.
Marla: I didn't think about that. I didn't even think of data. That's so true. We're data junkies.
Alex: Yeah, exactly. I mean, today I supervised one of my clients, and I just saw he had like, five programs, and I was like, oh, my God, he mastered so many things out in the time that I was away on vacation! This is amazing! I'm so happy!
I could add, like, a million new things now! Nothing really beats how satisfying that could be. When you just see all those 100% dots, all back to back to back to back, you're just like, those data points feel great. But, yeah, that definitely keeps me very optimistic, given that sometimes you beat some of the darkest days. I've had moments where I have some of the worst news ever, but then I go see that one client, and it's just like everything gets turned around.
Just hanging out with him for a little bit, and they can kind of talk with me, and then we talk, have a nice back and forth. And then I start reviewing their stuff, and I'm like, oh, man, you're doing amazing. Okay, you know what? Maybe everything's not that bad.
All things in perspective, right?
Marla: Yeah. I was also going to say, because it seems like Alex, you talked about data, right? Like, and that's a day-to-day thing that we do in our line of duty. I was also thinking something that also helps bring the optimism to me is overseeing my team and kind of seeing what they're going to bring today. What skills are they going to show off today? You know, because we meet with them every so often for their hours.
And so also seeing their efforts, right? And the work that they're putting in, that brings me joy and optimism, and I know that we're building, or at least again, for me, I'm trying to do the best that I can to build great leaders for our future, for our field, right? Because I'm not going to be forever, and Alex is not going to be here forever. So, like, kind of creating that future generation of BCBAs and supervisors and not just in the field of political or in-home, but in school or communities and group homes, or other types of settings. So that also brings me kind of optimism. And I think our science is always progressing, right? There's always something new coming out, and so it just kind of brings me excitement, you know, like, man, like, I wonder how the future is going to be with all of this.
So, yeah, I just kind of had to think about that. Like, what are my day-to-day things that I can bring optimism, like, yeah, self-care and all that, but I was thinking, like, oh, yeah, like, the people that I work with, right? That also brings optimism.
Well, thank you both so much. Thank you both so much for joining me this month and sharing your experiences. I love that all three of us do similar things in completely different spaces in completely different ways. So I've really appreciated having this conversation with you just as professionals and fellow clinicians out in the field, and we'll see where this conversation goes next.
Marla: Sounds good. Thank you so much, Heather.
Alex: Thank you for being here. Thank you so much, Heather.
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